Bud Norris to Cardinals

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This topic contains 107 replies, has 23 voices, and was last updated by  CariocaCardinal 11 hours, 53 minutes ago.

Viewing 25 posts - 51 through 75 (of 108 total)
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  • #43700

    blingboy
    Participant

    Bud Chuck in a Cards uni. I’ll buy a ticket to see that.

    #43701

    CariocaCardinal
    Participant

    Norris is not low hanging fruit. He is over ripe fruit Mo picked up off the ground! Not really, I have no.problem with the signing though I think the reported $3 million is a little steep in this climate it is not going to make or break us. I do wish when we gamble on a guy we would find a way to work in an option on the contract so that if the gamble pays off we reap a little more benefit.

    #43702

    1964cards
    Participant

    This is a steal, if … Norris can stay healthy and repeat his 2017 first half performance for the entire season. If not the club threw away $3M.

    I know most see Norris pitching out of the pen exclusively. I would think the Redbirds would want to ultize Norris in whatever mode would maximize his value to the club.

    #43704

    Bw52
    Participant

    So Morris made his comment in 2015 and apologized and has there been any problems because of that since then?
    Since I have never read of any problems with Norris and his teammates what was the reason for Ortiz’s comments?Attention whore to get people to read his trash.

    #43705

    Cardinals2016
    Participant

    Maybe he will take the Tyler Lyons role and Lyons will be the closer

    #43707

    Brianpnoonan
    Participant

    My biggest issue here isn’t norris… It is the insistence on 13 pitchers.

    We are going to lose games due to lack of pinch hitters.

    Norris for the money is fine. I agree we could flip him at the deadline possibly as well… Nothing wrong with a little creativity. I just don’t see how another reliever helps us even if he pitches well.

    #43708
    bicyclemike
    bicyclemike
    Moderator

    Agree with Brianpnoonan. 13 pitchers is ridiculous, especially early in the season with the off days. You’re going to have many games where you cannot use most of your roster. Plus if you have an injury to a position player, you’re really hampered.

    #43709

    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Sorry for repeating this for those who have read it a couple of times already, but the Cards have already said they may go with seven relievers the first week, when there are multiple open days.

    If there is an injury to a position player, then they are only going to be hampered for the remainder of that game – not a long time. They would bring someone up from Memphis right away.

    I am not a big fan of the four-man bench, but it is way of life. The way they burn through relievers, they may end up killing them otherwise. One can only hope the manager develops confidence in the back end guys so he actually uses them. Otherwise, I am convinced that Bowman’s arm will fall off.

    FWIW, in the AL, many teams go with a three-man bench. And no, they aren’t going to increase roster sizes to 26 or 27. That costs real money.

    #43711

    Brianpnoonan
    Participant

    The al doesnt require pinch hitters. Good ones are a luxury.

    In the nl, they are required. We do not have them.

    You can call up a new pitcher after the game if a guy has a tired arm. You cannot call up a pinch hitter in the same circumstances and in any game you are giving away outs after the sixth. Extra inning games are exponentially worse.

    12 barely makes sense. Whoever thinks 13 is a good idea should be fired and that includes mo. The idea is that asinine

    • This reply was modified 4 days, 20 hours ago by  Brianpnoonan.
    #43716

    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    I did some quick research and it looks like nine of the 15 NL teams went with eight relievers last year.

    When you own the teams, brianp, you can fire all of their incompetent staffs! 😉

    #43718

    858booyah
    Participant

    I personally think 13 has to be almost a given with the way Matheny burns out bullpens. We should for sure carry 13 guys in April. I don’t care about the extra days off. The starters don’t throw 6 innings until later in the spring ans who knows what this rotation is going to look like. We very well may have to quick hook some guys early due to pitch counts and performance. I’d much rather steal a couple games in April cause god knows we need all the help we can get.

    I don’t see it as a big of a problem as others. Trust me we’ve got more way to lose games than worrying about an extra arm in the pen. We’ve already got Fowler in RF, Carpenter hitting 3rd and the manager in the dugout to worry about.

    #43722
    BlackHillsCard
    BlackHillsCard
    Participant

    Speaking of trash, that’s how I feel about your “attention whore” and “Ortiz is a POS” comments, bw52. You’re like the meme of the old man yelling at clouds.

    #43724

    Brianpnoonan
    Participant

    I would fire them.

    You can use your aaa team like they should be used. We have arms. Use them.

    …and yes I realize that there’s roster limitations on callups. Ten days barring injury if I remember right. If you have four guys who can shuttle it isn’t an issue. We’ve got at least that who could fill in for a few days. Truthfully we probably have up to eight guys.

    Does that create other issues with rotations etc.? Yes. Make solutions, not more problems. Have eight starters at memphis and carry more pitchers there.

    The point is bullpen issues can be fixed with daily roster moves and pitching depth (something we supposedly have). Pinch hitters cannot.

    And the fact that the front office doesnt recognize that and fix the issue is pathetic.

    Burn out memphis, not st louis.

    • This reply was modified 4 days, 11 hours ago by  Brianpnoonan.
    #43730

    14NyquisT
    Participant

    I agree with bw that there are too many shenanigans taking place on the field already. IMO the “in your face” nonsense and that ridiculous on the field over-celebrating ala the bad news bears belongs, and is now expected, on the gridiron… not on a diamond. There should be an effort not to let the MLB emulate school ground antics but rather keep it more professional… more mature. If you crave showboating go watch wrestling.

    #43731
    bicyclemike
    bicyclemike
    Moderator

    And no, they aren’t going to increase roster sizes to 26 or 27. That costs real money.

    That’s the point that irks me. At one time teams carried only around 22-23 players (pre WWII). Then 25 became the norm, as the game evolved and more players were utilized. And again there was a time where a team could carry 28 (I believe, although that number may not be quite right) for the first month or so, giving teams a chance to use guys a little longer than just Spring Training before paring the rosters down.

    With the modern game heavily bullpen dependent, roster limits really should be expanded by one or two. But then professional sports are first and foremost a business. Everything else, with common sense way down the list and even including winning at times, falling behind in the pecking order.

    #43737

    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Well, Mike, we have talked about this back and forth for years, and I admit that I added the roster increase point to try to head you off! 😉

    Seriously, though, I am going to take the other side of the debate (what a surprise, eh?).

    IMO, the reason more players are needed is because of increased specialization. Larger rosters will mean even more specialization and longer, more boring games. Give them 10 relievers and they will use all 10. Give them 20 relievers and games will all last five hours.

    The game has survived for decades with 25 active players. They were given a 26th for doubleheaders. There are more liberal DL moves allowed so teams do not have to carry mildly injured players. That is just fine.

    #43738
    BlackHillsCard
    BlackHillsCard
    Participant

    Alright if you have a problem with the celebrations say that. Don’t single out an entire ethnicity when white players are as guilty of “shenanigans.” That’s the whole point with Norris. He singled out an entire ethnicity and then gave the ole apology but not really an apology.

    #43741

    Bw52
    Participant

    BHC-I might be the “Old man yelling at the clouds” in your words but i like what i like and don`t really give a damn what you think of my opinion.Yes i think Ortiz is a hack POS rabble-rousing turd.

    As i said earlier …have there been any incidents of discontent with Norris and his teammates since 2015 when he make the quote? I have read or heard nothing…so IMHO Ortiz is just a hack stirring the ashes trying to get people to read his horseshit column.

    #43743
    BlackHillsCard
    BlackHillsCard
    Participant

    I get sick and tired of old fuddy-duddies taking the fun of out of sports just because they are old and behind the times. Its a game for cripes sake. You might as well just have robots out there since that’s pretty much what you’re advocating. While you are entitled to your opinion, I think your opinion needs to be flushed down the toilet like the excrement it is. Your rant is so priceless. As they say in the south, bless your heart bw52.

    Let the guys play. Good grief.

    #43747

    PadsFS
    Participant

    BlackHillsCard

    Norris’ apology wasn’t really an apology. Saying his comments were taken out of context is a joke and B.S. If you want to believe that go ahead, but just so you know I’ve got ocean front property in South Dakota for sale.

    Bud Norris is from San Rafael (near San Francisco) where there is almost 50% Hispanic population. He went to college at California Polytechnic State University. I seriously think that his comments were taken out of context, given his background. Carlos Gomez is no stranger to controversy either.

    Here are Norris’s full comments:

    “I think it’s a culture shock,’’ Norris said. “This is America’s game. This is America’s pastime, and over the last 10-15 years we’ve seen a very big world influence in this game, which we as a union and as players appreciate. We’re opening this game to everyone that can play. However, if you’re going to come into our country and make our American dollars, you need to respect a game that has been here for over a hundred years, and I think sometimes that can be misconstrued. There are some players that have antics, that have done things over the years that we don’t necessarily agree with.

    “I understand you want to say it’s a cultural thing or an upbringing thing. But by the time you get to the big leagues, you better have a pretty good understanding of what this league is and how long it’s been around.’’

    And here is his apology:

    “It was a quick conversation after a game, and I was getting dressed to go see my family,” Norris told the Union-Tribune. “I feel my words were definitely misconstrued, but that’s beside the point.

    “I want to apologize for how it came out and the words that were taken out of context in passing. I apologize to anyone I might have offended. I love this game and admire everyone who plays this game with all the passion that I do.”

    “Actually in reading the article, I learned a lot more out of his point of view,” Norris said. “I never had the opportunity to play winter ball in a foreign country, and I guess a lot of players have said that they’ve learned some things about how they play the game. There’s things that culturally I don’t understand and haven’t seen with my own eyes. I don’t think I offended (Gomez) in any way, but we all come from different walks of life. Whether I was born in California and taught the game this way or in Mississippi or the Dominican or Japan or anywhere, we all come from different cultural backgrounds and we love this game, and that should be the No. 1 focus.”

    “I was taught differently, and I think that’s what I’m trying to portray,” Norris said. “I was not trying to light a fire under the other team’s behind, I wasn’t trying to give them more reason to try to beat me, and you’re never trying to show up the other team, the other players. That was the way I was taught and brought up in the Astros organization, to really mind your P’s and Q’s, mind your emotions….”I’ve been known to wear my emotions on my sleeve at times, so ‘antics’ probably weren’t the right word. I just think you have to mind your emotions and not allow your emotions to get the best of you.”

    But hey, let’s go ahead and let Ortiz drive a wedge into the Cardinals dugout right from the start with his agenda-driven articles and tweets.

    #43751
    BlackHillsCard
    BlackHillsCard
    Participant

    If you think that was an apology all I can do is laugh.

    #43758

    thejager
    Participant

    It seems everyone is clamoring for Holland yet his last year was a tale of a good first half and so so to poor second half…and he wants a ton more money

    and if we signed Holland people would be so happy and not even talking about his poor second half saying it was a fluke or whatever…but with a signing no one is looking for they use the bad second half and injury argument to attack the move

    NOrris is a solid depth vet signing…i agree the price is a little high, but it’s only this year, and as i said somewhere else he might be an attractive trade piece at the deadline should our youngsters like Hicks and Helsley and Reyes etc. be knocking the door down for the pen…we might not get much, but for low money and vet status and some closing history he may be a piece another team would like to add for their relief core should we not need him

    #43761
    BlackHillsCard
    BlackHillsCard
    Participant

    $3 million isn’t all that much. However, his contract is reported to be loaded with incentives so it will be interesting to see what those incentives are and for how much.

    #43767

    14NyquisT
    Participant

    If he gathers in the incentives, he would have had a good season and worth the money. Correct?

    #43768

    PadsFS
    Participant

    thejager

    And if we signed Holland people would be so happy and not even talking about his poor second half saying it was a fluke or whatever…but with a signing no one is looking for they use the bad second half and injury argument to attack the move

    Holland was also one of the very best relief pitchers from like 2011-2015. Quite a bit of history there with him.

Viewing 25 posts - 51 through 75 (of 108 total)

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