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January 5, 2018 at 4:31 pm #4122614NyquisTParticipant
Bleacher Report has put out their ranking of MLB farm systems. The list includes the top-10 prospects from each team and a level grading based on potential-talent-overall depth for the team-team’s high end talent.
The Cards ranked #13 with 4 prospects with the highest grade of 1. The four are all 22 y.o. or more which would indicate immediate MLB help. MIL has 7 with a grade of 1 and 22 or older… most teams have 1 or none at all.
January 5, 2018 at 6:38 pm #41228Thanks for sharing.
Does anyone know anything about Joel Reuter, the Bleacher Report author?
The only real surprise to me was Hudson left out of the top 10, but Delvin Perez in.
January 7, 2018 at 9:44 am #4127714NyquisTParticipantMaybe he checked out your rankings.
January 7, 2018 at 12:26 pm #41304He is simply not as familiar as we are, and these mistakes seem blatant to us. The rest of the baseball world doesn’t even notice.
January 7, 2018 at 12:43 pm #41308Wasn’t throwing stones, just asking an honest question. For one man to try to accurately assess all 30 organizations is a huge undertaking. I had never heard of this reporter so am trying to decide how much credence to give his work.
January 7, 2018 at 1:25 pm #41314No one knows our system better than us. I would take your opinion over any blogger. I love reading about the birds from any source, but I trust opinions of people like you, BobReed, CC, and others over any “expert” opinion.
I was excited when we acquired Orlando Sanchez. I dreamed on Mike Calise playing third base someday. I cried a little when Leon Durham was traded. Jerry Mumphrey was my favorite Cardinal when he played for Tulsa.
You are right. No one can follow even two organizations to the degree we follow this one.
January 7, 2018 at 1:59 pm #41321PadsFSParticipant13th seems low. Isn’t that about where we were a year ago?
January 7, 2018 at 2:03 pm #41323Interesting, Pads. Given the limited 2017 draft and the trades of prospects in and out sort of balanced, why do think the Cards gained ground on other systems this year over last? Again, just an honest question. No trap!
January 7, 2018 at 2:13 pm #41327Our pitchers survived unscathed beyond Reyes. We spent wildly on International guys and had a number of guys like Young and Kninzer surpass reasonable projections. We invested heavily in younger position players who haven’t panned out but still have prospect sheen
January 7, 2018 at 2:21 pm #41332Spending wildly internationally has yielded just two prospects in the system’s top 20 so far (Arozarena and Adolis Garcia who was too old to qualify for the spending cap). Oviedo and Machado may be the best hopes, but they are still young.
Speaking of… Young is ranked #45 in the system and not relevant to this discussion. Knizner had a great year and moved up more than anyone in the organization, but is nowhere near national top 100 material. Those are the kinds of players that move the needle in comparison with other systems.
January 7, 2018 at 2:28 pm #41334PadsFSParticipantIt seems like very few of the top prospects graduated, notably Reyes and Kelly. Flaherty took Weaver’s spot. O’Neill took Perez’s spot. Alcantara and Sierra (from 2017 rankings) are replaced by Hicks and Garcia or Knizner.
I guess I didn’t take the Ozuna trade into consideration. We did lose 5 of our top 20 (Weaver, Alcantara, Sierra, DeJong as well as Alvarez and Cordoba) and Perez fell like a rock. Munoz and Schrock don’t feel like they are as highly looked at as the guys they replaced.
January 7, 2018 at 2:31 pm #41335Wow that is a lot of attrition.
January 7, 2018 at 2:34 pm #41336PadsFSParticipantFor instance, next year I think we may have one of the worst farm systems in baseball, losing all the top 5: Reyes, Kelly, Flaherty, O’Neill, and Bader, as well as potentially losing Hudson, Hicks, Knizner, Helsley, Gomber, and Garcia. Maybe even Arozarena, Munoz, Schrock too. These are all players in the higher levels.
Our best hope is for Perez to come out hitting like crazy to get into the top 25-50 in MLB for us to stay top 20. Maybe Machado doing the same or Oviedo and Hicks pitching like Reyes and Hicks not getting a promotion to the majors.
January 7, 2018 at 2:34 pm #41337I am very interested in seeing what the national raters say about where they see the Cardinals system. I readily admit that I know one organization so much better than the others that I do not have a credible opinion on where the Cards fit vs. the other 29.
Every year I track the main national ranking concerns and compare and contrast what they say. Last winter, the Cards placed in the 12-13 range.
January 7, 2018 at 2:39 pm #41339Pads, you are on a point that I am seeing through my analysis of our 2018 Cards top 50. The prospects are skewed older and toward the top. A relatively weak draft class (or at least not fast to develop) and a lot of open questions on the international front create future uncertainty. This has come in up several articles already and it will be covered again in the five remaining analysis articles, coming this Monday through Friday.
January 7, 2018 at 3:21 pm #41342PadsFSParticipantTo change subjects a bit, you said this recently in an article and here is a quote from about a month ago:
Brian Walton
Don’t forget our #45 prospect Andy Young, who finished 2017 at Springfield. He makes 14.
As a point of reference, Memphis opened last season with five infielders and Springfield had six.
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Memphis: Max Schrock, Yairo Muñoz, Breyvic Valera, Wilfredo Tovar, Alex Mejia.
Springfield: Darren Seferina, Tommy Edman, Edmundo Sosa, plus Palm Beach promotion contenders Luke Dykstra, Rayder Ascanio and Jose (Alexander) Martinez.
These clubs will likely have room for only three or at most four middle infielders each. Urias is candidate number 12. (As points of reference, in 2017, Memphis opened with three; Springfield had four. That would have left five of the above without chairs.)(One of the quotes includes the three 1Bmen)
How do you see this working out soon?
I don’t know why Schrock would be in AAA and Edman would be in AA when Edman played in the AAA playoffs last year.
I don’t know why they are keeping both Mejia and Tovar. They seem rather redundant.
Wisdom is locked in at 3B, but it would be easier to DH him or play him at 1B to get the others some 3B experience, alas Luke Voit and Ravelo are also penciled in at 1B.
I have no idea how Urias will transfer to MiLB, but he should slot in at AA/AAA, but maybe they keep him in A+ to start the year like they did with Arozarena.
With Sosa’s AFL experience, you’d think they would begin him in AA again next year as the primary (and most important) SS on the roster.
The addition of Munoz makes Valera completely redundant.
With all these additions, they still have Seferina, Caldwell, and the guys you mentioned – Andy Young and the Palm Beach promotion contenders Luke Dykstra, Rayder Ascanio and Jose (Alexander) Martinez.
I have no idea what to expect this year.
January 7, 2018 at 6:42 pm #41354I think John Gant needs to get some type of Mr. Irrelevant award for being the least talked about player on the 40 man roster this off season.
January 7, 2018 at 11:32 pm #41361Pads, I do not know how the infield log jam is going to work out. Camp invitations and play during spring training should offer some clues.
I will comment on a couple of your questions.
Valera is redundant, but not because of Munoz. Munoz is primarily a shortstop while Valera is not. I consider Schrock to be Valera’s new competition at second base.
The fact that Edman was called up to Memphis to backfill in September is interesting, but not all that important. Schrock has over a full season at Double-A while Edman has a partial year and Schrock hit far better in the Texas League than Edman – they are not even close. I haven’t yet seen Schrock defensively, but he is said to be good at second. He is also a better prospect than Edman at this point, per our rankings. Therefore, all indications are in Schrock’s favor in a direct comparison. That is why Schrock would be my choice to start at Memphis at second alongside Munoz at short.
CC, I agree with you about Gant! The fact that he has remained a starter is one reason why I did not include him with Mayers (and Valera) as my most at-risk 40-man players.
January 8, 2018 at 3:33 pm #41384PadsFSParticipantThe reason I said Munoz replaced Valera was due to the Athletics playing him extensively at 2B, 3B, and CF in addition to SS last year. Also the fangraphs scouting report said these two lines in his write-up:
Scouting Report
Munoz has outgrown shortstop and moved full time over to third base, where his plus-plus arm is frequently on display….He projects as a second base/third base/outfield bench option.January 8, 2018 at 5:25 pm #41388I don’t know who wrote that from Fangraphs, but there is a LOT more to the story.
Melissa Lockard of Oakland Clubhouse (like me for the A’s) believes that Munoz can stick at short. As she was very clear about, the reason Munoz was moved around is that the A’s have two really, really good shortstops ahead of him. Both placed on national top 100 lists and both were on the same rosters as Munoz last season. Franklin Barreto was ahead of him at Triple-A and at Double-A was Jorge Mateo.
The wealth at the position so close to the majors is the reason Munoz was made available, in her opinion.
You can listen to her assessment here ($): https://thecardinalnation.com/going-deep-on-new-cardinals-munoz-and-schrock/
For the record, here are Munoz’ games played by position in 2017:
2B 2
OF 28
3B 36
SS 46 (22 at AA, 24 at AAA)As you can see, even when behind the two shortstops mentioned above, Munoz still played more shortstop than anywhere else. If he outgrew SS, why did they keep playing him there?
On the other hand, Valera is primarily a second baseman. I wouldn’t consider two games by Munoz at that position all season as extensive time. This is one reason why I do not see them in direct competition at Memphis. IMO, Munoz, 23, is a starter while Valera, 27, is going to fight for a reserve spot – and perhaps his future with the organization.
January 22, 2018 at 7:09 pm #42422Just had a chuckle I thought I would share. Received a press release from the new media assistant at Roger Dean. The subject is the JUPITER coaching staff (Marlins). The sender’s name is Tim VENUS. Far out!
January 22, 2018 at 8:18 pm #42425Sounds like Jupiter and Venus have converged. That could only mean good things for the Cardinals.
January 22, 2018 at 8:50 pm #42426It is a sign of the dawning of the age of Ozunias.
January 22, 2018 at 9:37 pm #42428Are they planning on launching a lot of balls into orbit.
January 22, 2018 at 10:30 pm #42434You people are spaced out!
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